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The Thalmor and the Telvanni?

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Joined: 06/21/2012

You think the Thalmor and Telvanni see each other

To me, they both are quite similar, in that they really dislike non Merish folks, have been/are isolationists, study just about every form of magic out there without really any taboo. The Telvanni even refused to join the Ebonheart Pact. Surely the two would see eye to eye on many levels?

Dargor's picture
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Joined: 07/11/2012

As far as doing what needs to be done to achieve their respective goals? If you put their hubris aside,  there would be some mutual respect for that at the very least. Beyond that however, the Telvanni are extremely self-centered and work to achieve their own personal goals, whereas the Thalmor are a political entity shoehorning themselves into whatever they feel like. The Thalmor (At least their Justicars and foot soldiers) are only mages since the Altmer as a whole are proficient with it to begin with.

Fiore1300's picture
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Joined: 07/24/2011

I don't know if the Thalmor would look upon the Telvanni with any respect. First and foremost, the Telvanni are Dunmer, who are the worst kind of heretic. Even worse, they're arrogant about it. Another sticking point would be the Telvanni selfishness in gathering magical power and knowledge around themselves, rather than using it for the liberation of elven kind. The Thalmor come across as one of those "if you're not with us, you're against us," groups, and the Telvanni are certainly not with them.

The Telvanni, for their part, probably don't like the idea of Thalmor operatives sneaking around trying to uncover their secrets. Nor would they appreciate the Thalmor's snobby sense of superiority.

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Joined: 06/21/2012

Yeah, I'd forgotten about how self-centered they could. Do you think, though, that with their general secularism (i.e. not really caring so much about the Tribunal and probably the Daedra Lords as well), isolationism and haughtiness that they might make some compromise? Especially now that they have nearly been destroyed? I would think that some Telvanni would start to come out more and advocate for something now that their entire House's survival is teetering. And, seeing as they are disdainful of anything non-Meri (and probably non-Dunmeri), some would think that their best interests could be compromised with the Thalmor? As the saying goes: 'desperate times calls for desperate measures'.

Fiore1300's picture
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Joined: 07/24/2011

^That's a fair point. Things have changed. We do know that the First Aldmeri Dominion did reach out to the Dunmer, but the Dunmer just laughed them off. And although the Dunmer in Skyrim are described, in general, as having 'no love for the Thalmor', perhaps there are individuals at least who look upon the Thalmor in a new light.

Dargor's picture
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Joined: 07/11/2012

As it is right now though, things seem to be going good for the Dunmer. Mournhold is being rebuilt, the houses seem to be back in business so to speak, and the only difficulties they face from abroad are boarder disputes in the south with Black Marsh. I don't think the Dunmer are looking to get into a war for a people they have no real love for while they're rebuilding.

Grogan gro-Shub's picture
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Joined: 06/25/2013

Might I ask, what does the Telvanni have to do with the Thalmor?

Vaerein's picture
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Joined: 06/28/2013

Not much.  Simply comparing the differences and likenesses in the groups.

Even less, now mind you.  After the whole 200 year blunder of jumping and treachery, called Skyrim.

The Telvanni are a vastly dying house, much like the entire dunmer nation.

Captain R.O.C's picture
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Joined: 09/11/2013

They are in different race.I don't think Thalmor would respect Dummer.

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Joined: 06/21/2012

So? Races can work together. They may not like each other, but they can.

Dargor's picture
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Joined: 07/11/2012

Sure, but zealous conservatives who both look down and despise anyone that isn't them? Even on a isolated island where the Dunmer are doing poorly for themselves, the Thalmor have no desire to even entertain the notion that the two can coexist. There's even a Telvanni mage-lord there.

They do seem to try and keep track of other magical organizations, as seen in Winterhold, for obvious reasons. However, if they tried to actively obstruct a Telvanni's studies, or even share a differing opinion, things would probably get cold fast.

Fiore1300's picture
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Joined: 07/24/2011

Dargor wrote:

Sure, but zealous conservatives who both look down and despise anyone that isn't them? Even on a isolated island where the Dunmer are doing poorly for themselves, the Thalmor have no desire to even entertain the notion that the two can coexist. There's even a Telvanni mage-lord there.

Well there is some evidence that the Thalmor are a pan-elven movement. For example, the original Thalmor reached out to Morrowind, but was coldly rejected. The Thalmor also has historical ties with the union of Valenwood and the Summerset Isles. If it is, then the non-cooperating partner here would be the Dunmer/Telvanni. And they're isolationists, so no surprise there.