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Explorations of a Theory: Blending Fallout and Elder Scrolls

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Cordate's picture
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This being as they are now, it's a different universe entirely. Whether they change that or not later has yet to be seen. However, they do have similarities like Numidium/Liberty Prime and The Brotherhood of Steel/The Blades

Rotting's picture
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yeah.. i think liberty prime is kinda like numidium is practice.. i keep reading more ES lore about the dawn era.. maybe it all takes place inside the mind of a very advanced ai.. the one that splits into Anu and Padomay.. and from there sires all the other ai's.. if we connect my hypothisis with that lore... then lorhkan was the ai that decided to clone humans and put them back on earth/nirn. 

rememeber the ai computers they might by the time the dawn era rolls around have figured out how to manipulate matter and energy itself useing a process that's discovered in fallout 4. they can exist as enegry and as matter.. they create the atherious not out of machinery but energy.. 

Cordate's picture
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Can AI's become schizophrenic? If so, and Synths (or AI in general in the Fallout universe) can, in fact, catch mental diseases, then correct me

Rotting's picture
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yeah i tend to think that if a computer is advanced enough that it can simulate consciousness like we have.. then i think it's safe to say they would struggle with there existence in much the same way as we do.. under too much pressure they would become mentally unstable.. 

i think that if something tells you it is conscious that is a pretty good reason to give them the benefit of the doubt.. lest you objectify a living thing. not that the altmer care about that.. they enslave goblins and lesser creatures.. 

Cordate's picture
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I suppose so, but would they be capable of Dream?

Rotting's picture
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what is a dream? it's the stirring of consciousness without input from sensory organs.. it's the mind existing on mental imagery in itself... if computers are ever going to become conscious they are going to need to have an imagination.. 

Cordate's picture
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Dream is the subconscious mind overrunning the conscious mind for the starvation period known as sleep

Rotting's picture
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subconsciousness? 

Rotting's picture
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some people say that dreaming is how the mind organizes and files what it has learned during the day. but i mean.. we also can do that when we are awake.. day dreaming.. when we think about things to ourselves... the subconsious is what makes what we think emerge.. it is the basic machinary of thought.. we dont control it.. it controls us..

Cordate's picture
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Can AI sleep?

Rotting's picture
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i don't know. but if they aren;t really.. biological... they wont have the same needs to eat and sleep as we do.. but i would think they would have to have the capasity to interact with some kind of subconsciousness if they have consciousness.. one presopposes the other..

Rotting's picture
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i mena what if an ai turned off all of it's senseory organs and just let it's own mind run... would that be considered a kind of sleep?

Cordate's picture
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Not really. That's like asking if you a person who is entirely paralyzed, but awake, is sleeping

Rotting's picture
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hmm.. this is getting complicated.. 

Cordate's picture
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Figuring out TES usually does that

Rotting's picture
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when you say completely paralized? you means you can;t see, smell, taste, feel, all you could do then is day dream... what would be the difference between awake and asleep at that point?  for the person? they'de have no way to tell the passing of time.. no way to tell if they were awake or asleep.. unless they were dreaming that they could see and hears and feel... of course when you are paralized soemtimes you can imagine hearing or feeling.. 

Cordate's picture
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With all that together, assuming they have been that way since birth, what would there be to dream about? All there would be is pure thought taking forms that we would never see. The way dreams work is like using the CS. All you can really do is take what's already been made and tell it to do something new. 

Rotting's picture
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maybe the sublties of just being would become more distinct.. maybe the mind would just wonder.. and that wondering would become a thing to work with..

Rotting's picture
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anu and padomay

Rotting's picture
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if there was some way for that thing to wonder it's way into a device that could allow it to experience time and space.. that would explane the birth of akatosh and lorhkan.

Cordate's picture
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Except, AI's would already have the knowledge, and their programmed thoughts would already have a course to run

Rotting's picture
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it kinda sounds like schizophrenia already. maybe that's how it starts for these future ai that may be the gods of elder scrolls. but because they really have access to some powerful technology... the multiple selves may just as well be called induviduals.. since they kind of exist anywhere that their computer matrix is.

Cordate's picture
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The Godhead is already established as schizophrenic

Rotting's picture
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well.. as the programming becomes even more intelligent it gains the abiltiy to build on itself.. that;s what the singularity is.. maybe the first ai to truely experience consciouness is just a program that has been building on itself untill it finally doesnt know what it is anymore.. it's just a being.. and it really starts to think and feel.

Rotting's picture
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maybe you can compare an ai before anuel.. as a sort of midbrain mammel.. it doesnt have the level of consciousness that it anuel has when it becomes aware.. that level allows it to manipulate things beyond itself and it's own programming.. somehow... don;t know how.. yes i know it's a big jump.. 

Rotting's picture
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if we think of how evolution works with us.. yes we have instincts.. we have programming.. but our consciousness doesnt connect directly to everything that makes us what we are... we don't have the memories of our ancestors in our heads.. those memories are in our instincts.. we have to learn about it though our consciousness..  if ai achive consciousness they may not have access to how they got to be who they are... their consciousness may be beyond that knowlegde.. and maybe by the time that happens.. that knowlegde just isnt available anymore... 

Rotting's picture
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ok.. I think I have come up with something to explane why daedra and aedra are different. so in the beginning.. somebody figured out how to create a state between energy and matter.. they used this technology to build aetherius. because all the energy resources on earth were depleted. the only hope of getting more energy was to manipulate electrons io come together in this matter/energy form. some how they controlled the electrons around the planet to form a matrix of small fusion reactions connected together.. this created a infinite source of energy for the whole planet.. but the problem was.. it was destroying the planet... so they had to build an absorber of this energy underneath atherious.. they used anti-matter.. and that matrix of anti matter exsisting in an energy/matter form was Oblivion. everything doing all this was probabaly ai from what was left of human civilization on earth.. they didnt really think of it... they just did it because their programming required them to find a way to get power to themselves. both oblivon and aetherious exist in this energy/matter state.. they are both there and not there... in this state the AI came to exist as well.. they kind of forgot about the totally physical world of earth... but once they really became conscious.. they started to wonder what they could make of all of this... lorkhan got some of them to go back to being totally physical... in order to create mortals and sustain a forever new.. the aedra all became matter again.. and the daerda remained in there energy/matter state.. 

Cordate's picture
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So, basically, a new world of linear but nonlinear time was made and it all depends on an outside intelligence to act on it. A game was made

Xarnac The Conqueror's picture
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Rotting wrote:

various quotes

... You can't have a changing theory that grows in complexity every time you learn more about Elder Scrolls/Fallout lore.

Occam's razor. 

Rotting's picture
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simple things are always able to be broken down into more complex parts.. we have to be as simple as we can be.. which i am being.. it's pretty simple so far i'd say. it's not a theory yet.. don;t have any evidence.. just conjecture so far.

If you knew that somehow fallout was connected to elder scrolls.. how could that happen?